VOICE2008 Creative Experience (ahem) Article

[Diane Havens]

Well, Todd, you can quote me if you like. Oh, and I forgot to include my cost analysis:

hotel room (4 nights, with family, double occupancy) $800
round trip air fare from Newark Liberty (got a great fare!) $369
meals (I may have skipped a couple) $300
use of the spa/gym (beautiful!) $20
drinks (lost count, but let's say) $150
tuition (what was it for early birds? includes tote/goody bag) $500

perfect LA weather FREE
invaluable informal chats with colleagues/coaches FREE
chocolates from Julie FREE
watching a few folks make fools of themselves FREE
watching many others make us all proud FREE

Net gain: Priceless

[CarynClark]

Hi Todd,

With all due respect, really and truly...

Some of us who went to VOICE have chosen to write our thoughts regarding the conference on various threads on this message board. So, if you want to find out what we thought, I think you should take the time to read the thread, rather than ask us to take the time regurgitate what we've already said. We're all busy.

As for using our comments on your blog, well, I'm really not sure how viable that would be, since you would just be re-purposing other people's words into your review and then giving your opinion... and, you weren't there, so I have to say, I agree, how can you review or blog about something if you didn't actually experience it yourself.

Just my two cents. Keep the change. Not trying to start a debate... just my thoughts.

Caryn

[John Bigl]

i don't get it... i just don't get it... i've read plenty of threads about the Voice conventions, and it really looks like alot of fun, the kind i'd love to go to but can't afford.. i hope it or something like it comes to Boston.. i'd love to cut a rug w/ Diane, and learn how to naturally exude some sullen and erotic bass tones outta my chest....

what i really really don't get is the contagious case of terminal lemon ass from the folks who just don't like these get togethers, for whatever reason, and their continuing desire to pick a fight over it... please, i may be green in this industry,and excuse me for gettin mouthy, but, *sigh*, let it go, will ya please? its okay to rock the boat, just don't sink the ship, okay?

[toddschick]

Hey John....

Good to hear from you....!

Glad to hear a few Canucks made it out; of course, easier and less expensive if yer on the West Coast.

Regarding this comment: "I kinda disagree with your suggestion that they made tons of money from the convention..."

I'm sorry, but I can't find anything in that article that even implies the fact they made a "ton of money". They generated a ton of money....yes. My point. How much they made is none of my (or anyone else's) business.

I just quoted the numbers on registrants - over a quarter million right there. Let's not forget that in most cases with conferences, organizers also charge vendors for booth space and take a cut off that...not to mention booth sales, paid advertising.....ton's of stuff to take a cut from. I'd say it grossed far more than that.

Hesitating about a 2009 event? News to me. I'm not sure where you heard this, but if it came from the horses mouth, all I can say is - that's just savvy marketing....

"Gee...yeah...I don't know....it's a lot of work......we didn't make much....."

All the more reason to raise the rates for the next show....isn't it? Look for heftier admission fees in 2009.

I've put some of your comments up, thanks John.

As for the boat cruise....I'll keep that in mind - but I'll tell you right now it's unlikely I would pay to attend something that's more geared toward those starting out rather than those who make a full-time job of it. Let me put it to you this way:

If I were to go on a cruise...or attend a conference....or whatever...it's not ALL "fun" for me. It's not a vacation. It's WORK. I'm the kind of guy who's very, very passionate about what I do and I LOVE to share information and my knowledge. That said, put me on a boat with a pile of people who feed on this information and I'd be sucked dry like a vampire seeking fresh blood from dusk till dawn......I would give far more than I could get....if you catch my drift.

We'll see what happens closer to the date. Thanks for the invite, though. I go to Vancouver quite a bit - I have family there.

Kind regards,

Todd Schick

[toddschick]

Hey Caryn,

I was hoping that no-one would have brought up the subject....but you have, so I'll respond.

I asked people to post here for basically.......political reasons. An organizer of the conference has taken great offense at what I have written; confusing jokes with slander and factual observations as a personal attack. Indeed, I've been the brunt of some pretty ugly correspondence.....

In the interest of not adding fuel to the fire, I chose to post on a single thread asking for contributions to the piece, in lieu of running the risk that my personal research (sifting through the forums) may imply bias and aggravate an already hostile situation.

That said...I don't wish to burden anyone....with anything. Yes, "we're all busy." Rather, in the interest of not ruffling any more feathers, I'll just post what shows up here....and go from there.

I hope you understand my position.

Kind regards,

Todd Schick

[toddschick]

Hey folks....

Some more stuff has been posted (at the bottom of the page) for your perusal....

The Post Voice2008 International Creative Conference Experience 2008 article.

Enjoy!

TS

[John Spackman]

Todd,

Your website editor's note (copied below) is not completely without merit but I'm not sure what can be expected from the large group format of a convention. It is the nature of the beast.

("Editors Note: I submit that one could only "pick up a few nuggets" because the rest of it was for sale in the back rooms")

Correct me if I'm wrong but it seems your main objections to "Voice2008" are that you feel the presentations were not geared to experienced voice actors, and that you would prefer some "hands-on" opportunities included in the registration fee. Once again both are valid comments, but if that's what you were looking for, then just don't go --- and you didn't !

In the bigger picture you apparently have little respect for voice coaches in general - or at least those who publish books, or sell CDs or write manuals or dare I say it .. "self promote". Have I got that right ? However I'm sure you agree that someone starting out in VO needs coaching. How do you "square that circle"?

It would be more interesting to all, if you would offer suggestions how to improve this convention rather than be so disparaging. Can you advise of voice "events" (other than individual sessions) that you do approve? If so, is there something specific you like about them?

John

[Diane Havens]

Another good reason to go to a conference like this one is to get a preview of what a coach has to offer. The general sessions were not intended to be ends in themselves but rather to give an idea of what you'd be getting in further -- yes, "paid" -- sessions with one. It is, after all, teaching, and as you've said, and after spending a good deal of my life teaching in private and public schools I do know, very hard work. I found this particularly valuable, since I had a better idea of just the type of coaching I'd get from each presenter -- and whether I could relate to their style of teaching -- and a big add to this -- whether I just plain enjoyed them.

This was the perfect relaxed atmosphere in which to do this. Mixers could be nice, but it would not be the situation in which to interact the way we did. To have some common experience to share. We'd get together with our colleagues and discuss what we'd just heard, talk about what worked, what made sense, what we liked and didn't like from the presentation. Those conversations are what brought us truly together, much as college chums, hanging at the student center between classes.

So that was my one and only suggestion for improvement. More down time between the structured presentations. Because it was in this down time, in that free exchange with friends, you made sense of it all, and problem solved with each other. Brainstormed. Told your own success stories.

And that is the direction all education has taken; there is much more collaborative learning taking place in education today. The students really learn the most from working with their peers -- but it doesn't mean we should do away with the teachers, or the principal, or the superintendent. They all have roles to play.

You seem to be an advocate of home schooling. That's another choice, and one which we all have to make for ourselves, according to our individual needs and finances.

Peace,

[toddschick]

Hey John...

Interesting observations....!

I speak purely from my own perspective, of which I expect no-one to completely understand. I hope my answer here will shed some light on that perspective...

"....you feel the presentations were not geared to experienced voice actors....."

Well.....the conference wasn't full of experienced voice actors, so there's your answer. Nothing to do with my feelings, but rather a fact. Several versions of "Voiceover 101" most of which has little or no value to someone like myself.....and just by looking at the coaches and their offerings months before the conference I very easily came to that conclusion.

"......you apparently have little respect for voice coaches in general - or at least those who publish books, or sell CDs or write manuals or dare I say it .. "self promote". Have I got that right?...."

No. People who blow sunshine upwards into one's nether regions for the purpose of selling their product I've got a BIG problem with...and there are many out there who do exactly that.

"YES! You got a GREAT voice! But...you need a little coaching...wink, wink. Here's my card.."

Good coaches serve a useful purpose to get someone started. And really, the more good coaches one can see, the better...as no one single coach will have all the answers for any one individual. However, there's only so much a person can learn from a book or a coach and at some point, the only way a person is going to get better at VO is simply doing the work all the time and getting experience. Truth be told....if anyone truly wants to be a great VO talent...well....at some point they will have to take to the theater stage and perform - for a couple of years.

Thespians possess all the skills great VO talent have - it's that experience that ultimately will take someone to "the next level" and there's not a VO coach on the planet that can teach that.

In the end though.....even Acting is merely a mechanism which augments the whole, which is Communication. VO Coaches never get this right. One must excel in every aspect of communication to become an effective Communicator. We're not "Voice Actors" or Voice Talent"......we're communicators. Interpreting (therefore transforming) the written word into a verbal context to enhance communication.

"......Can you advise of voice "events" (other than individual sessions) that you do approve?...."

I wish I could. VOICE2007/2008 was born purely from the immense growth of the industry fuelled by V123 and Voices.com. Coaches, organizers and others saw opportunity to line their pockets...and this is what has happened. 12 years ago...there wasn't even a "Voice Industry" at all. I know - I was one of 30 guys on Yahoo under the search term "voiceovers" in 1996.

Then out of nowhere...James proclaims "Our industry is fragmented and disconnected..." and we need to have a conference. I'm sorry...I guess I was sleeping when the "industry" all of 2 years of age, suddenly became "fragmented." What a load of hooey.

The bottom line is - a massive percentage of those in our "industry" have day jobs.....and making a couple grand a year simply doesn't qualify someone to call themselves a professional. John....I get 10 -20 emails a WEEK from people wanting to do exactly what I do for a living...and they're starting from Square One.

I did 12 years in Radio, 6 provinces, 8 radio stations. I learned recording engineering. Hosted hundreds and hundreds of events as MC. Read reams and reams of "cold" news copy. Wrote thousands of pages promos, liners and marketing material. I recorded audio into a Compaq 386 using a $400 Creative soundcard off my Pioneer cassette tape player/recorder and produced a stack of 80 floppies for my client before people even knew what a soundcard was. I Perfomed in a dozen theater plays (and counting). Even wrote my own play. I built my own website. Designed my own studio. The list goes on.....

And these people....want to do what I do for a living......and make piles of money at it. It's tantamount to saying....."I want to be an astronaut...!" Without owning a driver's license.

So....when you ask me why I appear to be a touch disgruntled....perhaps negative....know this. Myself and a scant few others invented the VO industry upon the inception of the Internet over 12 years ago. Now, we're looking at all these people jumping on the bandwagon.....(over, like....the last 3 years) and we're watching it overflow, sway, creak and buckle under the weight of everyone trying to get their share of what's been proclaimed as a "lucrative" market.

I've got news for you. If you don't have the talent or experience......there's nothing "lucrative" about the VO industry......because there's simply too many people with the same skill set vying for a piece of pie that's getting smaller and smaller by the day.

Negative? Cynical? Or.....the truth? I say the future will be the judge.

Regards,

Todd Schick

[Diane Havens]

I am so glad to hear that theater experience is what can take you to the next level -- because in addition to my education experience I have a master's degree in it along with a few years of working stage experience. I also think what many of us need is some business acumen, and that is a whole other college degree.

I understand your anger, Todd. But please remain calm. It is as it is. People will take from it what they will.

Again, peace, and let time indeed be the judge,